“How can anyone living through today’s bizarre and mutable weather not be concerned about global warming?” wrote David Kirkpatrick in a recent issue of CNN Money.
Kirkpatrick then goes on to tell us that he heard the best speech from former US Vice President Al Gore about unprecedented change in the earth’s climate seriously aggravated by human activity.
I was interested to know how much of the “unprecedented change” Al Gore attributed to “human aggravation”, but instead he just listed the “evidence” that “climate is changing”.
The following points are Kirkpatrick summary of Al Gore’s evidence:
“1. Global CO2 levels are way outside what have been historical norms over several hundred thousand years.
2. All ten of the hottest years on record, globally, have occurred in the last 15 years.
3. Last summer, all-time heat records were set in both the U.S. West and East.
4. Global ocean temperatures are far outside of historical norms.
5. Even after last year’s devastating Hurricane Katrina, the subsequent Hurricane Wilma was briefly the most severe hurricane ever recorded.
6. Last year Japan hit an all-time record for typhoons –10. The previous record was 7.
7. The largest downpour ever seen occurred last summer in India.
8. Thirty-five years ago there were an average of 225 days when Alaska’s tundra was frozen enough for trucks to drive. Today there are only 75.”
The first point doesn’t actually tell us climate is changing. Points 2,3,5,6,7 and 8 read like a mumble jumble of ‘cherry picked’ anecdote – but I can see there are some interesting statistics here. Number 4 doesn’t match. And I didn’t know that global ocean temperatures were far outside of historical norms?
Not that I deny climate change – there has always been climate change and there will always be climate change. But how much is due to us?
A movie by Paramount Classics based on this sort of ‘evidence’ and Al Gore’s personal journey of discovery titled ‘The Inconvenient Truth’ is due out in May. And there will be a book out by the same name, also by Al Gore. And, according to David Kirkpatrick, Gore is working with major environment groups in the US on a new consortium with the aim of running a “campaign of public persuasion” about global warming and its consequences.
I think the message is already out there – that it is getting warmer.
But no one really believes the world is about to end. Rather several of my friends, and lots of other people, have decided (as far as I can tell based at least in part on all the news reports about global warming) that they need to install an air conditioner, because it is going to get hotter.
The new air conditioners will be coal-powered, in so much as most of the electricity for Brisbane in south eastern Queensland, Australia, comes from coal-fired power stations.
Jennifer Marohasy BSc PhD is a critical thinker with expertise in the scientific method.
I’m going to focus on the a/c comment at the end, since the discussion of Al Gore and evidence for/against climate change is trivial compared to the discussion that has already taken place on this blog.
People are choosing to install a/c in huge numbers. If you look at ABS data, a/c usage has jumped big time, such that 60% of households now have a/c, up from 33% in 1994.
http://www.abs.gov.au/Ausstats/abs@.nsf/0/989527F462991F5ECA2568A90013933E?Open
This, of course, is nothing to do with the weather getting warmer by a few tenths of a degree, and everything to do with changes in the level of affluence of australians, changes to the price of air-conditioners, and changing expectations in Australia of what it means to be comfortable. I think that the idea that such a large percentage of people are installing a/c because of news reports on global warming is extremely far-fetched.
Hi Steve,
Thanks for focusing in on the a/c bit and I appreciate your comment that my suggestion is ‘far-fetched’. But do you have any data to back up your claim that its all about affluence and comfort?
Hi Jen,
I don’t have any great data, I guess it is mainly my opinion – that is a huuuge increase in the number of air-conditioners in the last decade, and i just don’t think it could possibly be due to news reports on climate change. To believe this, you would have to simultaneously believe that climate change stories are widely accepted and widely misinterpreted, and also believe that the bulk of the Australian population are very stupid – i’m not willing to believe the latter.
Here’s a trifling amount of data to support me:
You can download the full ‘environmental issues and practices’ ABS report – i linked to its summary in my first comment – here:
http://www.ausstats.abs.gov.au/Ausstats/subscriber.nsf/0/4B2EFD806DDA33CBCA2570C700729463/$File/46020_mar%202005.pdf
Reading through this report, you get
page 49:
“Comfort and convenience was the most important factor for households (36%) installing a heater (regardless of type). This was cited by 48% of households with reverse cycle air conditioners and 42% of households with electric heater”
Talking about heating rather than cooling, so not convincing.
Report on a/c for AGO: the quote is not empirical data, it is expert opinion:
http://www.energyrating.gov.au/library/pubs/200509-ac-aust.pdf
page 8:
“It is unclear why the market has grown so rapidly since 1999, but in part it would appear that air conditioners have become more affordable together with an increase in net household incomes.”
The comfort/affluence reason fits in very well with the trend towards larger, more ostentatious homes – did you see the 60 minutes report titled ‘the castle’ last night?
http://sixtyminutes.ninemsn.com.au/sixtyminutes/stories/2006_02_26/story_1583.asp
I will look at the reports – haven’t yet.
I don’t have any polling or other data.
But I am always asking people (out of curiousity) what they think about global warming. So I have a few anecdotes.
I had my hair cut before Christmas and the hairdresser said she didn’t know that much about global warming, except that they were getting airconditioning installed at home because her Mum was concerned it was going to be a very hot summer. And of several other people I know who had airconditioners installed before Christmas – when I quizzed one, she said that sooner or later I would be doing the same because “summers are going to get a lot hotter”.
We have to be gentle with Algore. We are watching the slow demise of a man into insanity.
We just need to nod quietly in agreement, which his doctors say is a neceassary element in helping Al with his dementia.
So let’s all be supportive of Al during this difficult period of his life.
Ironic, one is bound to suspect that many of the Global Warming groupies could make all the necessary adjustments to the warmer temperatures by simply getting a hair cut.
And one must suspect that a lot of the energy consumption implications of aircon is not the fact that it is being installed but, rather, that they are being installed in houses that are getting bigger and bigger while the number of occupants of those houses is getting less and less.
There is no question that, on the cooling side of things, a/c uses more energy than pedestal or ceiling fans, or an open window when the breeze is blowing, though with arguably more comfort provided.*
However, reverse cycle a/c is an efficient method of heating the home, much better than electric resistance heating, and comparable greenhouse emissions to gas heating.
I agree though that energy usage of a/c could be curbed greatly if there were more people living in smaller homes instead of the current trend to fewer people in larger homes. Good home design/insulation/orientation is also a factor too.
* I say arguably because some people don’t like the artificial constant temperature provided by an a/c, and would prefer to feel some degree of temperature change. Such people might find a well-designed home with ceiling fans to be more comfortable than a refrigerated home.
“Your comment was denied for questionable content.” What on earth is this all about?
In the last decade the number of houses with plasma TV has exploded.
This global warming sure has got a lot to answer for.
In the last decade the number of houses with broadband internet has increased exponentially. Since 1996 the number of houses with DVD players has gone through the roof.
This global warming sure has got a lot to answer for.
Oh I think I got it. Jennifer’s software doesn’t like two or more sentences in a row starting with the same phrase.
I’m also interested in the air conditioner argument. I bought a newly built two storey townhouse in Melbourne in 1997 and was amazed to find that on really hot summer days the temperature upstairs was unbearable- sometimes reaching 35 degrees celsius when the temp outside was in the mid 40s.
I was amazed because I thought modern building codes would ensure houses were constructed much better than this.
I am determined not to get an airconditioner. I have instead put tinting on the North and South facing windows, use external bamboo blinds, planted trees near the windows and I have a deciduous climber (virginia creeper) climbing up the north side of the brick work.
I estimate these few inexpensive alterations have made a 5 degree celsius difference in summer. And of course these options are much cheaper and energy efficient than a built-in air conditioner.
I would aircondition the office, but simply do not have the power. Even a small-space dehumidifier would require 1.4kwhrs/day or a quarter of my daily hydro input. A small a/c requires 2.5kw and at 12 hours (in a tropical environment) represents 30kwhr/day. As it is, generating my own elecrticity costs between 20-30 times as much as equalised tariffs.
To what extent do consumers of national electricity pay for the full life cycle costs of supply (including the costs of impact mitigation)? I ask, because the shortfall might otherwise be regarded as subsidisation.
I could run an a/c via engine generator at about $20 per day.
Jen,
Your comment that point #4 (Global ocean temperatures are far outside of historical norms) “doesnt match” appears erroneous.
Please see the NOAA/NCDC global annual temperature analysis, and in particular the global ocean temperature analysis, at:
http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/oa/climate/research/2005/ann/global.html#Gtemp
The 2005 global ocean temperature anomaly of +0.44degC was the second warmest on record:
http://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/oa/climate/research/2005/dec/global.html#Temp
Clearly ocean temperatures are currently as high or higher than at any time in the observational record, hence placing them well outside the statistical norm. Hope this helps your understanding of the observed climate change.
A little out of date, but interesting reading http://www.townhall.com/opinion/columns/markalexander/2005/04/22/15206.html
Passive cooling units are available, as are a myriad of cooling options. a/c is an entrenched option. Of course it’s linked to affluence: it’s a want, you don’t buy one unless you can afford it; plus long-term, it’s often not the cost smart option. Building or renovating to standards for coolth as well as warmth can earn back the capital costs in energy savings in a short period. There’s much activity in this area, incl. new standards in Aust.
Neil you might be interested: CSIRO are trialling a solar dish (durable concentric rings) with stirling engine that can produce hot water, electricity & coolth. Dug up a link: http://downloads.publish.csiro.au/ecos/ecos_download.cfm?article_id=EC124p28.pdf&issue_id=124&issue_year=2005
On prominent US speeches and corporate lobby (fascist) powers: check out this speech by Robert F Kennedy Jr, including “details of some 51 state prosecutions that have been dropped during George W. Bush’s presidency”:
http://www.bigpicture.tv/index.php?id=73&cat=&a=179
posting for Cathy
—————————
Steve Munn (who seems to imply, as do others, that using electricity to run air conditioners is somehow immoral). Do you also wear horsehair underwear in winter in preference to turning a heater on?
And ABW (who thinks that any temperature measurement that is “currently as high or higher than at any time in the observational record ..plac(es) them well outside the statistical norm”).
It is the bane of all discussions on climate change that people limit their discussion to the “observational record”, which at most is available for about the last 200 year period. Record highs or lows achieved against such a miniscule-length record tell one precisely nothing about whether they fall outside natural climate variation norms, which must be judged against records of AT LEAST tens of thousands of years in length.
A reasonable argument, based on only the last 200 years of record, might be that the RATE of change of temperature in the late 20th century exceeded long-term geological estimates of rate of change. Unfortunately, the rate of change of air temperature over the last 30 years (the period for which we have accurate satellite records) lies between 1 and 2 degrees C per century. This falls precisely in the middle of the range of natural rates of temperature change inferred over the last 10,000 years from Holocene climate records, i.e. there is no evidence that current rates (or magnitudes, for that matter) of atmospheric temperature change in any way exceed previous natural bounds.
The same general result is true for rates of past sea-temperature change compared with those observed in the 20th century.
Cathy
——————–
Cathy was blocked for ‘questionable content’. Sorry about this ‘system’ that sits behind this blog and knocks out comment that includes ‘three full stops in a row’ i.e. …
Thanks, Cathy, a timely reminder.
So how does “nature” change the climate – why does it happen ? .. .. .. .. .. .. ..
So the irony is that some climate people are running around saying that the earth is getting warmer, we made it so by using too much energy and things could get real bad and people respond by buying an AC unit thereby putting increased pressure on energy systems.. .. ..
“Some” climate people – see “most”. It’s called the weight of evidence from a range of sources.
But yes the positive feedback loop is ironic. Wait till the Chinese and Indians all start buying them.
People are simply buying air-cons as (a) they are cheap – thanks China and Harvey Norman (b) split systems sort out the noise problem and (c) summers in Queensland, and other subtropical and tropical parts of the nation, have always been warm and humid during summer – people get all hot & sticky. Air-con has always been popular – now you can afford it.
If you’re not worried about greenhouse – install some more and crank it up. Even if you are you’re still going to do it. As the world gets warmer people will naturally install more systems. That’s the free market – give the consumers what they desire. What’s wrong with that ?
It’s got zilch to do with climate scientists.
Cathy – “This falls precisely in the middle of the range of natural rates of temperature change inferred over the last 10,000 years from Holocene climate records, i.e. there is no evidence that current rates (or magnitudes, for that matter) of atmospheric temperature change in any way exceed previous natural bounds.”
So why does that let us off the hook. All that means is that we are causing warming at the same rate as natural warming in the past. Past warming events had triggers and causes. This time it is our greenhouse emissions. It does not prove that the warming is ‘natural’
Ender,
You couldn’t be further off track.
“All that means is that we are causing warming at the same rate as natural warming in the past”.
It means no such thing. The null hypothesis is that the coolings and warmings seen during the 20th century ARE part of natural cycles unless and until it can be shown otherwise. It can’t and it hasn’t.
“Past warming events had triggers and causes.”
Of course. And we remain in ignorance of the precise triggers and causes except at the most general level. We are therefore in no position to attribute similar modern changes to an anthropogenic cause.
“This time it is our greenhouse emissions”
That is a statement of belief, not science.
Cathy
Cathy – “The null hypothesis is that the coolings and warmings seen during the 20th century ARE part of natural cycles”
Started to type a long response – couldn’t be bothered – done it many many times.
Cathy – why would you say that warming due to greenhouse emissions is a statement of belief (just asking !)
“Steve Munn (who seems to imply, as do others, that using electricity to run air conditioners is somehow immoral). . . ”
Nobody is implying that using electricity to run air-conditioners is immoral.
Lets take a step back from extremism please?
If anything, what we are implying is that there are alternatives to air-conditioning, and challenges/considerations/issues with the increasing use of a/c.
I think that waste should be avoided, and i think it makes sense to suggest efficient ways of providing comfort while reducing electricity consumption accordingly.
Also, its not immoral, but perhaps it is innappropriate, that those who don’t own an a/c subsidise those who do own an a/c to the tune of several thousand dollars for the additional infrastructure required to support the peak load of that a/c on the grid.
And I’d again reiterate that it is not at all plausible that vast numbers of people are putting in a/c because of stories of global warming.
The West Australian today (1/3) reports that Perth has just had its coolest summer since 1959-60 – 45 years ago. OK, proves nothing, but since we are hammered regularly with examples of hotter than usual weather allegedly as proof of global warming I think it worth mentioning.
Courier Mail in Brisbane also running with:
“THE state’s sweltering summer, which ended at midnight, will go down as the hottest on record.”
http://www.couriermail.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5936,18310820%255E3102,00.html
I don’t have the numbers – but just on observation as one drives around and noting the sheer number of outside compressor units from a/c split systems that are about in the suburbs – all sorts of suburbs, rich and poorer – that we seem to moving to a fully air-conditioned society in SEQ at least. Interesting issue for the power grid in a heatwave as to whether it will cope. People will leave them on 24 – 72 hours straight so the house does not heat soak while you’re at work. Put a bit of storm damage over the top of that or even before in recent weeks and it would be most interesting.
Ironic how all those Southerners move up to SEQ for the warmth then melt in the tropical humidity.
Down in the Hunter the big hospital, John Hunter in Newcastle, has no A/c. The Govt designers/architects used passive solar principles and oriented it so that it would be cooled by afternoon sea breezes. Unfortunately they didnt arrive and anyway they cant leave windows open patients could jump out from the top floor and temps are generally +10C higher than outside ie 40 outside and 50 inside. Patients faint and are always stressed and families come in to drape them with wet cloths. Someone bought a fan in but it was not allowed, prob a OHS issue. When the bushfires came up to the hospital it was so hot inside someone opened a window and it filled up with smoke and had to be evacuated. Nurses bought in rules, when temps are high they work slow. After years of this the new Premier has said that it will be A/c’ed
Stupid isn’t it.
Thanks Steve. I was brought up with the “waste not, want not” expression drummed into me from a young age.
Such thinking may not sit well with Cathy but I have seen no reason to doubt it.
Ice Block Protest Wins Air-Conditioning Battle
Type: Union News Subject: Public Hospitals
8 February 2006
NSWNA member at John unter hospital hand out ice blocks to the public during a heat wave without air conditioning
It took one thousand ice blocks to finally melt the Health bureaucracy’s 15-year resolve to deny air conditioning to John Hunter Hospital in Newcastle.
On Monday January 17, the hospital’s 15th birthday, members of the NSW Nurses’ Association stood at John Hunter’s main entrance handing free ice blocks to everyone who came and went.
With every ice block came this message: ‘Nurses are doing this as a protest to mark 15 years without air conditioning. We aim to put some of the heat suffered by patients, staff and visitors onto the Department of Health and the state government.’
The hospital has between 650-700 beds and 450 have never had air-conditioning.
As Health bureaucrats and politicians tucked into a birthday cake in the hospital cafeteria, hundreds of people – patients, visitors and staff – milled around the entrance to offer support to nurses and sign their petition calling for air conditioning in all wards.
The government caved in that afternoon, agreeing to provide the
$8.9 million needed to fully air-condition John Hunter.
‘We are all thrilled by the decision – it’s a huge win for the Nurses’ Association,’ said Jade Starkey, a clinical nurse specialist in paediatric oncology and NSWNA delegate.
Another NSWNA delegate at the hospital, RN Andrew Rigg, said nurses would keep up the pressure to have air-conditioning installed as quickly as possible.
‘We realise it will take time but we have told the department we want to see work underway by November this year,’ Andrew said.
The NSWNA branch at John Hunter first raised the heat issue with management in January 1991, shortly after the hospital’s opening, and every summer since.
‘We gave management 12 months notice last January and they did nothing,’ Andrew said.
‘This summer was really unbearable. On New Year’s Day we had a heatwave and bushfire which got close to hospital, and because of that the staff had to close out all the windows. There was no airflow and the temperature inside some wards reached 48 degrees.
‘Staff were really stressed and patients were suffering acutely.
‘Nurses put up wet towels and sheets by the windows to try to cool things down and humidify the air. They were handing out drinks left right and centre, trying to keep everyone cool, calm and collected.
‘Imagine coming in after a fall or a hip operation, or a car accident, or giving birth and then having to endure temperatures in the forties.’
Delegates also reported that pregnant nurses had sometimes been forced to leave work early and people had fainted because of the heat.
‘In the paediatric ward, we have had children in traction come out in heat rashes that just would not heal.
‘There are problems with blood that is hung up getting too hot, and infection implications of sweat dripping into wounds.’
As this issue of The Lamp went to press, the NSWNA was negotiating with management on interim measures to relieve discomfort and risk to patients and staff before air-conditioning is installed.
The union is seeking:
+ Extra staff during hot periods to provide patients and staff with hourly ice and drink rounds.
+ Implementation of ACTU or WorkCover guidelines on working in heat, which provide for extra rest periods each hour when temperatures are excessive.
+ Nurses to be allowed to wear cooler clothing when the ward temperature reaches 31 degrees.
+ Wendy Goodman, NUM and the John Hunter Hospital Branch Secretary, said the interim measures to combat heat are extremely important. ‘It’s about the safety of our staff and ultimately, the safety of our patients. If nurses can’t function, they can’t work. The interim measures make sure that nurses, and patients, are not at risk.’
Call For Industry-Wide Action On Heat
NSWNA General Secretary, Brett Holmes, called on state and federal governments to commit to making air-conditioning available in all health and aged care facilities.
‘The heat issue has serious clinical and occupational health and safety risks in health and aged care facilities,’ Brett said.
‘It’s an issue the NSWNA faces every summer across the hospital sector.’
Brett wrote to NSW Premier Iemma outlining some of the ‘horrendous and dangerous’ conditions experienced by John Hunter patients and staff and asked him to provide funding to air-condition the hospital.
‘Heat is also a major problem in the aged care sector, with thousands of elderly people, many bed-ridden, forced to sit out the summer in rooms without air conditioning,’ Brett said.
‘It’s time the Federal Government also got its act together and did something about the appalling conditions aged care residents and staff often have to put up with during the summer months.’
(cont’d)
http://www.nswnurses.asn.au/news/3967.html
Affluence: yes; global warming: probably. But many urban and suburban homes have installed air conditioner units as a result of excessive and growing traffic noise, forcing people to keep windows and doors closed, shutting-off natural ventilation.
Indeed development approval is dependent on this in Brisbane, where exposure to noise (not just traffic) is above a threshold, nullifying any sub-tropical design principles.
Talk of using land more efficiently and using transport corridors to squeeze people in will only serve to increase the use of air conditioning, especially as road use grows faster than the population.
In short: poor urban planning / transport policy is to blame.
Bill Cole,
And if we remove the UHI effect, it is even cooler for Perth. Once again falisfying AGW dogma.
I should add that all the temperature anomalies are in fractions of a degree celsius, well within the instrumental error of the instruments used to create those numbers.
The argument over global warming is not based on measurement, but on minute statistical fluctuations of dubious validity.
And a profound ignorance of physical science.
ABW,
the use of temperature anomalies as an indicator of climate is simply specious – temperature anomalies are simply departures from a predefined mean temperature.
It is the mean temperature one is interested in, not the departures from that mean.
Statistics, more statistics followed by damn lies.
Louis what you written above is total drivel !
Phil Done,
You just don’t understand it do you – the fact you need to call my statement drivel is a classic case of messenger shooting, avoiding the necessity of countering by well reasoned logic.
Temperature anomalies are created by subtracting the mean temperature based on some arbitrary climate period, usually 1961-1990, from the yearly values, thereby accentuating miniscule temperature fluctuations which are increasingly being recognised as “statistical noise” rather than real changes.
Instead it may be more accurate to dismiss your rants as lynsenkoism – politically correct drivel.
Louis – words fail me. It’s a problem when you don’t know what you don’t know.
Just graph the absolute temps on a decent scale and show us the comparison.
If you’re going to get academically sophistilicated and philosophical please get it right – I think you’ll find it’s actually “lysenkoism”.
The term “Lysenkoism” survives as a metaphor for other beliefs challenged by empirical evidence but preferred for ideological reasons. e.g. the campaign against genetics in the Soviet Union.
So Louis this is actually YOU not me – you are denying the empirical evidence from many sources which we have well quoted ad nauseum on this hallowed blog.
So spare us the one-liners – you have the personal blog – write the critique of why all the evidence is wrong and/or give us an alternative hypothesis.
Lysenkoism – ha ! indeed ! what a pretentious try-on. (the Cold War is over mate !)
Louis has coined the term ‘climosenkoists’ on his blog.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHA.
I encourage him – I know I shouldn’t. But his blog is a great daily tonic, and life is far too serious.
You can ease up now Phil, Ender has scuttled back to his windmill, plans and tools firmly in hand.
Louis is big on scepticism but thin on explaining his alternative explanations. It would be nice to know eg his own summary of how the evolution of life forms happened.
Enjoy his crazy world. The Dutch have a saying that translates ‘just being normal is crazy enough’.
Oh another HAH HAH HAH, the irony of all: Louis wrote “When you start to lose and (sic) argument, the usual ploy is to then accuse one’s opponent by reference to being a Nazi or Hitler.” I take this as an admission by Louis that he lost all the previous discussions where he made samesuch offensive accusations. (Don’t try yr usual denial tactic Lois).
Sorry Rog – I have been on ANGER MANAGEMENT THERAPY at the double Y chromosome detention facility but sometimes IT STOPS WORKING and you want to KILL a rabbit or SOMETHING.
Louis – words fail me. It’s a problem when you don’t know what you don’t know.
Just graph the absolute temps on a decent scale and show us the comparison.
– I have Phil.
If you’re going to get academically sophistilicated and philosophical please get it right – I think you’ll find it’s actually “lysenkoism”.
– Always give the critics something to bitch about.
The term “Lysenkoism” survives as a metaphor for other beliefs challenged by empirical evidence but preferred for ideological reasons. e.g. the campaign against genetics in the Soviet Union.
So Louis this is actually YOU not me – you are denying the empirical evidence from many sources which we have well quoted ad nauseum on this hallowed blog.
– Really Phil ? Evidence for your assertion?
So spare us the one-liners – you have the personal blog – write the critique of why all the evidence is wrong and/or give us an alternative hypothesis.
– I use one liners since anything more complex seems to confuse you.
Lysenkoism – ha ! indeed ! what a pretentious try-on. (the Cold War is over mate !)
Is it Phil? Or has it metamorphosed into something else?
Louis is big on scepticism but thin on explaining his alternative explanations. It would be nice to know eg his own summary of how the evolution of life forms happened.
– Simple Phinksys, I don’t know.
Enjoy his crazy world. The Dutch have a saying that translates ‘just being normal is crazy enough’.
– we Dutch have another word “Onzin” – which surely applies to your comments here.
Oh another HAH HAH HAH, the irony of all: Louis wrote “When you start to lose and (sic) argument, the usual ploy is to then accuse one’s opponent by reference to being a Nazi or Hitler.” I take this as an admission by Louis that he lost all the previous discussions where he made samesuch offensive accusations. (Don’t try yr usual denial tactic Lois).
Lois? No need to reply – Phinksys (related to Thinksys in anyway) has changed targets – I wonder if after Lois Superman might be the next in line. Who knows. Fink, Phink Think, syssy silly names apparently.
Aha,
Phil and other commentator Phil Done are the one and same?
Now that is schizophrenia if I understand it correctly, and being done by two minds has to be an impressive feat too I just realised.
Finksys, (or is it Phink or Think)
I have never accused anyone of being a Nazi or a Hitler.
I did, however, note the commonality between Greenies and National Socialists, and in particular pointed out the well known historical fact initially enunciated by Hitler in Mein Kampf, and subsequently elaborated by Goebbels, that if you repeat a small lie often enough, it eventually becomes accepted as a fact.
Subsequent interpretations and extrapolations are exclusively yours.
However if the hat fits, wear it. If not???
Louis – if you didn’t exist we’ve have to invent you.
Anyway Thinsky (aka Phinsky or Enviro-babe, Suicide-Blonde, Red November, or Mata Hari) and I have been playing with this concept where all these wacko eccentric and highly opinionated people communicate through a blog, which bizarrely through dialectic, motivates global vormers to create from first principles and rational systems analysis a new Australian National Socialist movement which overthrows the state and nationalises everything. All activities which generate CO2, CH4, and NOx are monitored by the State and excessive emitters are put into concentration camps. Lavoisier becomes the name of the underground “resistance movement” who go around blowing up wind generators and starting up decommissioned power stations in the dark of night.
Do you want to be in the film as the hero loner trying to prevent this from happening? Can Louis and the IPA save the free market in time. Will Phinsky stop at nothing. We think there’s a market niche for such reality docu-drama?
The title “Bond length”.
or “The Hissink 7”
What do you think !? I reckon we could work together.
In cyberspace noone can hear you scream.
Phil,
I don’t really need to counter your posts – you seem to be able to do that on behalf of everyone all by your self. I think its termed Circular reasoning in that the contradictions to your rants are already implied in your rant.
I think I will enjoy your future soliquies on Jen’s blog.
Now Louis don’t be a complete watje
How is global warming man’s fault? Here’s some facts to blow away the anti-combustion engine facists. Remember MT.Pinotubo in the Philippines?
That one eruption, put more carbon dioxide, sulfer dioxide, and methane, into our atmosphere, than the entire industrial revolution of mankind.This is undisputed fact. One volcano!
Try this one. Mars is heating up too. Is my truck responsible for this also?? The Martian atmosphere has been heating on measured basis, that coincides with earths heating climate. Hmmm!
Maybe the Sun might have something to do with it.
I just love the shrill clammer of doom, that squeeks from the quivering lips of liberal greenhousers. But, the true realization is this;
Facts to a liberal are like what Kryptonite is to Superman. Deadly. And to be avoided at all costs.
Quit blamin’ America. Have you been to China?? I have. The air is thick like pea soup, in many cities. Have you seen the coal burning plants in Russia or Eastern Europe?? I have. The ground for miles around grows nothing. It’s black and dead. Even the heartiest weed, grows limply in this evironment.
America’s rivers are cleaner than twenty years ago. The air is cleaner than twenty years ago.We spend more on pollution control than all the other industrial nations combined. So quit your whinning. Grow a brain. Quit regurgitating bogus tripe, from scare tactics driven hype from liberal facists.
While a volcano may put out all the stuff at once, the Earth has remained in some sort of balance with this for a long time. Usually, except for cataclysmic events, change has been pretty slow. It’s not now.
Surely, whatver the facts are if there is even a slight _chance_ that we are causing the Earth’s woes, we should be making every effort to prevent this.