Climate Update: November 2011

Dear all.

Please find below a link which will take you directly to a monthly newsletter (ca. 1.3 MB) with meteorological information updated to November 2011:
http://www.climate4you.com/Text/Climate4you_November_2011.pdf

All temperatures in this newsletter are shown in degrees Celsius.

Previous (since March 2009) issues of the newsletter, diagrams and additional material are available on http://www.climate4you.com/

All the best, yours sincerely,
Ole Humlum

Ole Humlum, Professor of Physical Geography
Department of Physical Geography, Institute of Geosciences
Norway

77 Responses to Climate Update: November 2011

  1. bazza December 23, 2011 at 10:32 am #

    “All is grist to the mill” and there is even a pretty polynomial for good? measure.

  2. Neville December 23, 2011 at 10:51 am #

    Thanks for that Ole and your work on this site to make it easier for we amateurs to try and make some sense out of the climate.

  3. Luke December 23, 2011 at 12:57 pm #

    Aren’t we supposed by cooling ? http://www.abc.net.au/news/2011-12-22/pilbara-sizzles-through-record-heat/3744692

  4. gavin December 23, 2011 at 1:21 pm #

    I usually go SST first cause that’s our largest heat sink.

    http://www.bom.gov.au/climate/enso/

  5. bazza December 23, 2011 at 1:47 pm #

    Loved the sea level one particularly an empirical forecast ( contradiction in terms to be sure)and the inspired use of a 3 year running mean! ” The thick line is the simple running 3 yr average forecast for sea level change until year 2100. Based on this (thick line), the present empirical forecast of sea level change until 2100 is about +20 cm.” So I wonder what sense Neville is extracting from that? ” easier for we amateurs to try and make some sense out of the climate.”

  6. spangled drongo December 23, 2011 at 1:58 pm #

    “Aren’t we supposed by cooling ?”

    When you throw out all the old 19th century records, manipulate and adjust, you can make the climate do anything.

    Talking the talk also helps:

    http://climatesight.org/2011/10/18/a-conversation-with-gavin-schmidt/

  7. spangled drongo December 23, 2011 at 2:03 pm #

    And when you’re talking the talk you gotta get your words right:

    http://blogs.agu.org/mountainbeltway/2011/10/17/words-matter/

  8. Robert December 23, 2011 at 2:40 pm #

    So, if a December temp in Birdsville was hotter than the one in the Pilbara, and that day was in 1972…

    And if December here on the east coast is decidedly cool now…

    And since contrary weather conditions are almost the norm between east and west of the continent…

    And since I can’t find a reason to believe, or disbelieve, we’re heading into a Little Ice Age or AGW, with or without “masking”, which is one almighty fudge word anyway…

    And since the problem with computer models is not that they might be wrong or have been wrong…

    Since the problem with computer models is that they MUST be wrong, for reasons that should be obvious to an aphid…

    What is the point? That we have only five years to avert Catastrophic Anthropogenic Junk Education?

  9. spangled drongo December 23, 2011 at 3:08 pm #

    “Aren’t we supposed by cooling ?”

    It all depends who you talk to:

    http://www.real-science.com/jimmy-works-arctic-magic

    “What is the point? That we have only five years to avert Catastrophic Anthropogenic Junk Education?”

    Neville, the catastrophists are rushing the education so that brainwashing can just pip reality at the post.

    Then it won’t matter what the weather does, the world will be convinced it’s warming.

  10. Robert December 23, 2011 at 3:12 pm #

    By the way, our hottest ever recorded temp was in Cloncurry, January of ’89. (Yes, I’m up to my old tricks – it was 1889.)

    Some say our Marble Bar heatwave was the most severe ever recorded anywhere. Over 100F for 161 consecutive days. 1923 to 1924. Oh well, at least that’s within a century.

    WA stars again for sustained heat: 333 days over 90F…as recently as 1946!

    The worst weather conditions for my part of the world, going by temp and factual description by very reliable sources, would be that lethal northwesterly in high summer described in Watkin Tench’s journal. Far worse than a mere heatwave, I’ve experienced these conditions twice in my lifetime, early eighties and around 2000, but not with the severity of the early 1790s, with bird and bats dropping dead to the ground.

    And what does all this prove?

    Nothing. Not a bloody thing.

  11. gavin December 23, 2011 at 3:36 pm #

    Robert; a couple of dots won’t make a picture and one thermometer can’t make a record

  12. spangled drongo December 23, 2011 at 3:53 pm #

    Robert, here on the western side of Mt Tamborine for most of this month we have been getting a temp range of aroung 17c min and 25c max. Today was 18-23 but it has been overcast and showery.

    Like a lot of eastern Aust it’s been cool and I just consider myself lucky because I’ve “done a perish” too many times to wish some of those old conditions back. I know what reality is and I know when I’m well off.

    When Slim Dusty gatecrashed Radio 2KM in Kempsey in the ’40s to sing “When the Rain Tumbles Down in July” he wasn’t singing about normal weather patterns, he was most likely referring to late season cyclonic depressions that occurred regularly then but which haven’t been around these last 35 years.

    “The limbs from the old gums are falling
    When the rain tumbles down in July.”

  13. spangled drongo December 23, 2011 at 4:04 pm #

    “one thermometer can’t make a record”

    Why’s that, gav?

    If anyone had one at Rose Hill in the 1790s when those birds and bats were dying in flight they’d have set a record all right.

    Mind you the BoM would have adjusted, deleted or “manipulated” it by now. ☺

  14. Robert December 23, 2011 at 4:22 pm #

    Gavin, I dare say the thermometers at Wyndham and Marble Bar could well have been defective for months on end without anybody noticing. Moreover, a thermometer placed elsewhere but nearby could well have registered a different temp. Another place far away could have been much hotter, yet, without a thermometer, no record. As a fan of SSTs you are no doubt aware of the fantastic variability of those temps within the smallest areas. I find forest edges amazingly variable on still nights, even over a few metres.

    So I concur with the spirit of your response. A couple of dots certainly won’t make a picture. Recorded data is always superficial and seldom gives a true representation of what actually happened. It tells us a bit, and that bit can be of interest and limited use. If a local tells you a bit about the wind and the persistence of the conditions etc, you’ve got a few more dots.

    Like I said, none of these records prove a bloody thing to me.

    WA, by the way, also has a very interesting and famous case of extremes in one spot. The most rain to fall in one place in WA was nearly 30 inches in a day. Imagine! That was Whim Creek in 1898. Then, in 1924, Whim Creek got just 4mm for the whole year!

    What do I make of that? Not a bloody thing. Like you say, Gavin: a couple of dots.

  15. Neville December 23, 2011 at 5:36 pm #

    Gee this inane nonsense seems to go on and on. Phil Jones has told us via the emails that the models are no good and temp, SL’s, SLR are not at all unprecedented or unusual at this end of the holocene.

    The last unusual phenomina was the LIA and any slight warming since is self explanitory coming after such a sustained coolng.

    Of course the greatest temp increase of our holocene was a 10C temp increase in 10 years.
    Evidence of this amazing increase of 1c per year for a decade has been found in Greenland and in S. America. This was 5,500 years ago at the end of the Younger Dryas.

    Rather makes our 0.7c increase over 100+ years seem rather puny. Barrie Pittock of CSIRO included the above extreme warming in his book ” Climate Change”.

    Our flat topped interglacial is also the coolest of the last 5 and will probably be the longest and 3 cheers for that.

  16. Luke December 23, 2011 at 5:53 pm #

    Yes yes yes – but luminaries like Archibald and Birdy promised we’d be a bone crushing ice age by now? What happened? One whiff (or is it two) of a La Nina and the lads go berserk.

    And talk about inane nonsense – Neville sprouting forth about a datum point (or maybe two). Pullease !

  17. Neville December 23, 2011 at 6:08 pm #

    More silliness from silly Lukey. When did Archibald say we’d be in an ice age by 2011?
    What we do know is that your hero chief Commissioner Timmy Flannery definitely made all sorts of predictions about SL’s and rainfall that we wouldn’t see again. What a drongo and a giggle this delusional fool has proven himself to be over the last decade.

    But also what a complete embarrassment to Oz as well, but definitely fits the Gillard govt model to a tee. He’s their perfect Chief Climate Commissioner.

    BTW when did Birdy say we’d be in an ice age by 2011 as well? Birdy are you out there in the ether somewhere, please come and defend yourself.

  18. Robert December 23, 2011 at 6:50 pm #

    SD, I’m with you over the current weather pattern. I like it. In 2005, in Rome, I remember being startled by thunder in winter. It was so strange to me at the time. In 2007 a shift took place in these parts, and we’ve had thunder and southerlies each winter since, El Nino of ’09 included. The pattern of frequent three day westerlies under bare skies in July and August is gone for now…thank God. Parched and cold, yuk. With infernos in September.

    Of course, there was supposed to have been a flip in the PDO in 2007, and some say we are due to have decades of weather more like the fifties and early seventies. I doubt that any of these so-called cycles are very regular and predictable, and it’s worth remembering that nasty droughty period around 1960. My impression is that the period between the two world wars was somewhat akin to the decades after the late seventies. The famous stumbled-upon WAPO account of Arctic ice melt in the early twenties is a bit of a match with 2007, but I’d be cautious about all that, since 1922 and 2007 do not occupy the same slot in their respective “cycles”. If there are definable cycles, I’d be careful with the definitions and make few predictions. Really, one can only observe and learn…and stay a bit skeptical.

    Ten years ago even I would have been scratching my head over the lyrics to Slim’s song…but this July it happened, in a big way. But only when we get southerly busters at the end of every hot day through summer will we know it’s safe to break out the Patti Page records – and get right back to those fifties.

  19. gavin December 23, 2011 at 8:58 pm #

    Robert, SD: It’s very hard to calibrate a group of thermometers in air and so we should routinely immerse them in a liquid bath for that purpose. I worked with hundreds of the better scientific and industrial models around after ww2

    On the other hand a common u tube max/min type won’t go down that path so we are stuck with non precise instruments everywhere and at a glance BoM data gives no clues re instrument or reader errors.
    We don’t even know the brand names. All we can do today is flatten potential errors the best way we can.

    I have no doubt though we had pretty good records considering older weather station practices including their routine daily max min scores. One must ask; can we keep our peas frozen or cook a christmas cake with any of them? We don’t have tha so important steady state to link the dots.

  20. spangled drongo December 23, 2011 at 9:32 pm #

    And prior to Stevenson Screens those thermometers were kept on cool verandahs, the coolest part of the house yet the BoM discards that data and Jimmy Hansen excrapolates all sorts of warm data from unmeasured frozen areas.

    http://www.real-science.com/jimmy-works-arctic-magic

  21. spangled drongo December 23, 2011 at 9:37 pm #

    I think I saw on the web today somewhere that “excrapolates” = anal retrieval.

  22. gavin December 24, 2011 at 4:24 am #

    SD; there is a trend for some contributors to become less scientific as we go on

  23. Another Ian December 24, 2011 at 6:04 am #

    Speaking of calibration – –

    http://wattsupwiththat.com/2011/12/23/friday-funny-new-noaa-supercomputer-gaea-revealed/

  24. spangled drongo December 24, 2011 at 7:35 am #

    You are quite right gav and I think “excrapolation” describes it well.

    Ian,

    Just goes to show that if you excrapolate long and loud enough you get the funding to grind it even smaller.

    They’ll get some highly refined excrapolation from that lot!

  25. Debbie December 24, 2011 at 8:02 am #

    Luke?
    What happened indeed.
    Simple answer.
    Their projective modelling was faulty.
    So is the current modelling. Emerging real data is refusing to match up.
    It is more serious this time because a political agenda has been attached to it.
    They can’t afford to be wrong. In fact they will spend more to prove they weren’t wrong rather than properly updating the data.
    The agenda needs us to believe that science and a centralised bureaucracy can manage the climate.

  26. Luke December 24, 2011 at 8:10 am #

    What are you on about Debbie – you have no idea my dear. Just gibberish.

  27. Debbie December 24, 2011 at 8:42 am #

    So the projective modelling is all OK then?
    And you haven’t noticed that the entrenched bureaucracy on an economy of scale would rather spend $millions proving they weren’t wrong rather than a weeks wages of a data entry specialist to fix up the mistakes?
    Gibberish indeed. ROFL.
    You asked what happened. . . just offered an answer :-)

  28. gavin December 24, 2011 at 8:49 am #

    “properly updating the data” assumes you can go back there hey Deb?

  29. gavin December 24, 2011 at 8:55 am #

    For those who haven’t got it yet, continuous readings are the only way to map any event such as weather and climate change.

  30. Neville December 24, 2011 at 9:28 am #

    Poor old Gav and Luke are still desperately clinging to their delusional faith and yet the fundamentals of that faith are falling apart.

    A good response by Spencer and Christy to reported nonsense brings up the fundamental problem of all of the models.

    Upper air temps are warming the same or less than surface temps and yet the models predict that warming should be amplified with altitude and even Ben Santer agrees that should be the case. Every CAGW freak has stated this is a fundamental belief of their modeling faith.

    Of course the problem of the famed hot spot thats refused to show itself is another nail in the coffin of CAGW and the looney models.

    So no hot spot and no amplification of temp with altitude just proves what a mess the models have got them into. But Luke and Gav will soldier on regardless and couldn’t give a bugger about REAL scientific observation and facts.

    Both embrace the fraudulent co2 tax although it can’t alter temp or the climate by a whisker, but will help send more of our industry and jobs overseas. What a pair of clueless donkeys.

    http://www.drroyspencer.com/2011/12/addressing-criticisms-of-the-uah-temperature-dataset-at-13-century/#comments

  31. John Sayers December 24, 2011 at 9:30 am #

    Sure has been a cool couple of months down here SD. The Xmas beetles are late.

  32. gavin December 24, 2011 at 9:54 am #

    What “REAL” scientific observation do you have to hand Nev?

  33. spangled drongo December 24, 2011 at 10:11 am #

    Merry Christmas John!

    We had summer some time on the last day of November but I was on the toilet and missed it.

    Tasmanian weather.

    I’ll bet the country’s looking green down there. Our Christmas beetles are looking a lot smaller and fewer to me this year. Must be the cool weather ☻.

    Hey gav, does that rate as a “scientific” obs?

  34. Robert December 24, 2011 at 10:15 am #

    My coolest December here. Even the sly BOM agrees! (I once caught them rounding their original reading for a freakishly cold October day here. Do I need to tell you which way it was rounded?)

    Anyway, what does this low mean max for December signify? Don’t know if you’d call it a “blip”, a “continuous reading”, an “event”. I’d call it a few weeks of unusually cool summer. And it signifies nothing.

    Not a bloody thing.

  35. spangled drongo December 24, 2011 at 10:28 am #

    “Neville sprouting forth about a datum point (or maybe two). Pullease !”

    Luke in his denial-and-cherry-picking hat and waffling about datum points again.

    They’re all datum points lukie luv, depending on context.

    And here’s another one:

    http://www.real-science.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/ScreenHunter_39-Oct.-10-22.03.jpg

  36. bazza December 24, 2011 at 10:35 am #

    Robert, there are two bleeding obvious insights available from thinking even briefly about weather and climate temperature records. The longer the period of record, the less likely a record will be broken ( if there is no trend). If there is trend eg up, then the more likely max temp records will be broken. Experience from 194 countries around the globe is consistent with these basic statistical principles. Your condensation of your experience makes you an outlier.

  37. spangled drongo December 24, 2011 at 10:45 am #

    Deb, I think the catastrophists have a dog and a double barrelled gun. If they don’t get their agenda through propaganda, they’ll get it through impoverishment but their dog meanwhile will eventually wake up and bite them where it hurts.

    It’s just gonna be a long process.

  38. spangled drongo December 24, 2011 at 10:56 am #

    Hey, lukie luv!

    Would you rate this as a datum point?

    Or does it just put most of your datum points in perspective?

    http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k247/dhm1353/DO.png

  39. Robert December 24, 2011 at 11:11 am #

    Bazza, it’s so odd. I was in complete agreement with you right up till that last sentence, though you were certainly doing nothing more than stating, as you said, the “bleeding obvious”. I didn’t do a count of the 194 countries whose experience confirms what is, even for me, the “bleeding obvious”. And it was a fair guess that 194 countries would be found “around the globe”, so I suppose that’s another thing that’s “bleeding obvious”. No matter. Nothing to disagree with, and concordant with all I’ve said above. (See: “signifies nothing”. Also see: “Not a bloody thing”.)

    And then, out of nothing, that rather flowery bit about my condensation of my experience making me an outlier! A piece of purple patronising worth of the Fairfax press.

    Perhaps you are in a mood to contradict me, but can’t find the what-for?

  40. cohenite December 24, 2011 at 11:31 am #

    Speaking of temperature Spangles there was a recent gerfuffle about WA having the hottest temperature since the devil walked the Earth and had a holiday at luke’s place; you can see it here on the 21st:

    http://www.bom.gov.au/jsp/ncc/cdio/weatherData/av?p_nccObsCode=122&p_display_type=dailyDataFile&p_startYear=&p_c=&p_stn_num=4035

    49.4C at Roebourne; the only problem is Roebourne imports its temperature from Roebourne airport which has hourly readings; the hottest hourly readings from Roebourne airport on the 21st were:

    1pm – 47.6C
    2pm – 47.8C
    3pm – 47.7C
    4pm – 47.9C
    4.38pm – 45.8C
    5pm – 44.8C
    6pm – 43C

    Which are available here:

    http://www.bom.gov.au/products/IDW60801/IDW60801.94308.shtml

    Some adjustment, eh?

  41. Neville December 24, 2011 at 12:30 pm #

    Gav paragraphs 3, 4, 5 and 6 above GEEEZZZ.

  42. gavin December 24, 2011 at 1:34 pm #

    Nev; when I checked back you haven’t offered a shred of original data or thought.

    Back on theme; individual instruments in the hands of householders only became of age about same the time we stopped broadcasting time pips.

  43. Neville December 24, 2011 at 2:07 pm #

    Gee Gav and how recently have you measured the different levels of the atmosphere?

    Can’t you understand how desperately silly you’ve become? Let’s face it we are all looking at info and studies and measurements that we can’t possibly carry out ourselves so what is your point?

    I’m reporting about an assessment made by the two men who have been the leaders of a team that produce the UAH satellite temp record from the NASA Aqua satellite.

    Have you got such limited powers of reasoning, logic and commonsense that I need to explain this to you? I’ve quoted directly from Christy’s article and if that’s not good enough for you then your ignorance is your problem not mine.

  44. spangled drongo December 24, 2011 at 2:34 pm #

    cohers, I see they note that numbers in itallics = Not quality controlled or uncertain, or precise date unknown.

    So did they change to the airport from November? Anyway as you point out, it’s obviously wrong.

    Since they’ve scrubbed all the old records which our teachers taught us in school and they rewrite history, to me it makes all those new records look “anally retrieved”.

    Why would they do that without an agenda?

  45. debbie December 24, 2011 at 2:40 pm #

    Go back where Gavin?
    I was talking about the real time data as it emerges.
    As far as I know, it is not necessary to go back anywhere to get that?

  46. spangled drongo December 24, 2011 at 3:44 pm #

    Here’s one yul luv, gav.

    Too bad it’s 1939!

    http://www.real-science.com/1939-worlds-glaciers-retreat

  47. spangled drongo December 24, 2011 at 4:15 pm #

    And a Happy Christmas, MDB!

    http://www.smh.com.au/environment/station-buyout-a-waste-of-money-20111223-1p8ln.html

  48. Neville December 24, 2011 at 4:54 pm #

    That’s a great find SD but Gav will say it’s a hoax unless you were there in 1939 and measured all those glacier retreats all over the planet personally.

    Then he’d insist that you’d have to have met all the other people who measured those glaciers 100 or 200 hundred years ago, otherwise he wouldn’t believe you.

    But of course this is the same Gav who thinks that we can change the climate and save the planet by imposing a co2 tax on Aussies as long as we reduce our emissions by 5% by 2020.

    It seems that delusional Gav doesn’t quite understand simple kindy maths, but hey whats that matter between CAGW fanatics.

  49. John Sayers December 24, 2011 at 5:09 pm #

    Birds Fly…….Reindeer Don’t……It’s just the truth….don’t freak out

  50. ianl8888 December 24, 2011 at 5:11 pm #

    SD –

    the WORST thing about the real-science article is that GEOLOGISTS were doing the puzzled talking. In today’s watermelon greenie-world, the only people more unscientific than engineers are geologists. Absolute baby-eating pariahs :) Fit only for digging holes in the ground, which everyone knows any fool can do with a shovel

    This is quite noticeable in the meeja (MSM). Fairfax has gone as far as airbrushing geology out of the scientific disciplines, never to be mentioned except perhaps disparagingly as an agent to destroy aquifers. And as for engineers – they build ugly, planet-destroying smokestacks, don’t they ?

    Besides, 1939 … well, people didn’t really know any better then

  51. spangled drongo December 24, 2011 at 8:32 pm #

    Yes ianl, as sceptics know, it’s the agenda, not the science and ironically those NZ glaciers have since advanced.

    And they call us deniers….

  52. Neville December 24, 2011 at 8:55 pm #

    Interesting temp record of Nuuk Greenland certainly shows warmer temps in the 1930s and has been cooling over the last 100 years.

    Lomborg also talked about the Greenland temp record and came to the same conclusion.

    http://www.real-science.com/greenland-meltdown-update-2

  53. Luke December 24, 2011 at 9:12 pm #

    Why not celebrate the new year with some real science http://www.seaci.org/publications/documents/SEACI-2Reports/Program_Annual_Report_2010_11.pdf

  54. spangled drongo December 24, 2011 at 9:58 pm #

    Real science, eh?

    If I thought I could believe it I’d be happy to wade through all that “science” but when it is modelling based on more CO2 = more heat and more heat = less rainfall, you can include me out.

    Particularly when I am see out my window more CO2 = less heat and less heat = more rainfall.

    And I’m not claiming that’s the full story but somehow I know it won’t even get a guernsey in your pretty picture book.

  55. Neville December 25, 2011 at 7:20 am #

    Amazing it just seems the hockey stick won’t stop rolling over. Interesting email from Mann HS co author Bradley airing his doubts about their reconstruction.

    Interesting he states that if there was medieval warming he thinks the forcing at work would have been the Sun. But of course the Sun can’t have any forcing worth talking about in the modern warming can it? Just think about it we’re wasting billions because of this frudulent nonsense.

    http://wattsupwiththat.com/2011/12/24/mann-hockey-stick-co-author-bradley-it-may-be-that-mann-et-al-simply-dont-have-the-long-term-trend-right/#more-53634

  56. John Sayers December 25, 2011 at 7:33 am #

    The average max temp in my region for December is -4.8C below the longterm average. The min is 2.1C below the average.

    Yet they are freeking out over .8C warming over 100 years.

  57. ianl8888 December 25, 2011 at 7:50 am #

    @Neville

    The actual waste of $billions has become immeasurably worse in the last few days

    The EU Brussels Commissariat has decreed that any commercial flights landing or leaving the EU zone be “carbon taxed” for the full flight distance. This development has been brewing for quite a while now, but is cogent because an EU judge has decreed that such a tax does not “interfere with the sovereignty of other nations”

    China, amongst others, disagrees and is developing responses, including a possible trade war

    Try the calculation of a return flight from Sydney to the UK or Holland, acknowledging that the EU demands that it collects the full-distance tax, regardless of which non-EU countries the plane flys over before finally landing (both ways). Then multiply this by the number of weekly passengers from Aus and all other more distant countries

    Also a cutesy-poo way of helping them fill the $$hole left from their own profligacy

    As I said, real damage is now being done … not arm-chair waving anymore. These people are really dangerous

  58. spangled drongo December 25, 2011 at 11:34 am #

    Today, Christmas day, is another king tide the same as Nov 26 however we also now have a semi-cyclone just offshore, big surf on the ocean beach, a higher SOI and quite low barometric pressure, all contributors to higher sea levels.

    But guess where it came to on the top of the tide? [and I waited around till it started to ebb in case I missed anything]

    “Still Waiting For Greenhouse”! as the late, great John Daly would say.

    Similar to last year, about 9 inches below half a century ago.

  59. John Sayers December 25, 2011 at 6:30 pm #

    We’ve almost reached the longest day of sunshine. It’s 7.28pm and it’s still shining.

  60. gavin December 25, 2011 at 7:30 pm #

    SD -see this from one of your own band

    http://kenskingdom.wordpress.com/2011/12/05/sea-level-change-in-australia-whats-likely/

    There is no way SL is going down from any angle

  61. spangled drongo December 26, 2011 at 7:47 am #

    Gav, did you read any of that?

    It’s a report by Ken Stewart on a report from the Climate Commission.

    Flummery’s mob.

    And did you also read Morner’s report?

    http://www.spectator.co.uk/essays/7438683/rising-credulity.thtml

    And you know from your own knowledge of Ross’ mark at Port Arthur that there is nothing different happening.

    But thanks to stupid green politics predicting these SLRs, councils are making people import fill to build higher on their land which, in a flood/sea surge [which are common in coastal Aust], will displace flood waters higher into established buildings and affect existing homes which wouldn’t otherwise have been affected.

    These same councils had adopted policy after past flooding not to do this [import fill] for this very reason. You could only fill and increase your relative level by excavating your own land [if possible] and using that fill so you did not increase the overall flood level by raising the flood plain.

  62. Luke December 26, 2011 at 9:02 am #

    Morner – just another flim flam big noting himself after being rebuked in the literature by his peers – and pretending to be someone he’s not. I love the people you drag up.

    “Dr Morner was, quite some time ago, president of one of INQUA’s commissions, indeed, the commission on sea-level changes. That commission no longer exists, as such, but is now part of our Commission on Coastal and Marine Processes. Dr Morner’s views concerning sea-level change are his own and are not endorsed by the current Executive Committee of INQUA, nor have previous INQUA Executive Committees endorsed Dr Morner’s views. On several occasions INQUA has requested of Dr Morner that he not inadvertently represent his views on sea-level change as if they have some connection with INQUA.” http://scienceblogs.com/deltoid/2009/11/the_australians_war_on_science_42.php

    or perhaps dowsing ? from Wikipravda Mörner has written a number of works claiming to provide theoretical support for dowsing. [1] He was elected “Deceiver of the year” by Föreningen Vetenskap och Folkbildning in 1995 for “organizing university courses about dowsing…”.[2] In 1997 James Randi asked him to claim The One Million Dollar Paranormal Challenge, making a controlled experiment to prove that dowsing works.[14] Mörner declined the offer.[15]

    Your guy SD !!

    As for Ianl comments about CAGW supporters on engineering and geology. What fantasy. All part of the sceptic meme to represent climate science as soft science.

    Soft science that SD ducks and ran a mile away from when confronted with what real modern climate science from SEACI looks like. Something NOT from dowsers.

    In fact what do 8 august geological bodies really say about AGW http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_opinion_on_climate_change

    BTW as for sea level rise in Qld – well tabulated and reported as it is – hardly hidden …

    http://www.derm.qld.gov.au/register/p02256bl.pdf page 228

  63. kuhnkat December 26, 2011 at 9:18 am #

    So Little Lukey,

    with all that well documented sea level rise, could you point to one of those endangered isalnds just centimeters above the water line which has gone under??

    Could you point to lost land that has been inundated, as opposed to eroded somewhere due to all that evil sea level rise??

    Sorry about that well documented then.

  64. John Sayers December 26, 2011 at 11:23 am #

    Luke – have you read the INQUA statement on climate change?

    http://www.inqua.org/documents/iscc.pdf

    Have you checked out who is heading this august scientific body? It’s headed by a palaeoecologist from South Africa, most are biologists and only one of them has any sea level experience which has been limited to the Mediterranean and surrounds.

    Morner on the other hand has studied sea level globally for 35 years, he’s been to the Maldives, Bangladesh the Pacific Islands etc.

    So why do you take the word of a group of biologists over the word of a serious researcher on the subject. I’ll tell you why, it’s because INQUA support your pathetic theories on climate as they parrot the IPCC in their reports.

    http://wattsupwiththat.com/2011/12/01/hiding-the-decline-down-under-inconvenient-papers-censored/

    BTW there’s a dowser in Tenterfield who is flat out trying to keep up with the demands from the local farmers.

  65. spangled drongo December 26, 2011 at 11:25 am #

    “BTW as for sea level rise in Qld – well tabulated and reported as it is – hardly hidden …”

    R U Kidding?

    This is simply a paper of “no data” [25 years and in that time these gauges have even been moved]

    It’s based on IPCC predictions, the Stern Report and GCMs!

    Quelle science!!!!

    The only thing I found believable was the paleo graph and even then they claim that 3.5 meter increase in SLs back then was “around present day height”

    My data is better than theirs.

    No wonder people who know a bit about the history of SLR, like Morner, are sceptics.

    And when people like you and the govt spout this crap and use it to formulate long term policy it makes any normal person very sceptical and very wary.

  66. Robert December 26, 2011 at 11:33 am #

    When sea level is constant, when temps are regular, when catastrophes, even in this age of instant reportage, are rare…then we will indeed be experiencing profound climate change.

    Water-divining, moxibustion and crystal healing are rightly regarded as unfounded and probably false. They differ from climate modelling in that climate modelling MUST be false.

    Sometimes one really can hear the laughter coming from the future. It’s not our tatts or our planking fatalities or middle-class white rappers which the future finds so amusing. It’s our climate models – where the superficial meets the complicated as an explosion of mindless conjecture.

  67. spangled drongo December 26, 2011 at 11:46 am #

    John, thanks for those links. This one shows about what’s happening:

    http://wattsupwiththat.files.wordpress.com/2011/12/sydney_ft-dennis_slr.png

    Robert, I bet luke has tatts.

  68. ianl8888 December 26, 2011 at 12:02 pm #

    Oh Ho, Resident Dipstick

    Your quote:

    >As for Ianl comments about CAGW supporters on engineering and geology. What fantasy. All part of the sceptic meme to represent climate science as soft science.<

    I was commenting on the predilection of the MSM meeja to disparage geology and engineering (NOT actual hard science viewpoints), but your squawk exactly fits your constant argumentum ad hominen dipstickeries and feeble strawmen

    As a perfect recent example, we have seen many purported cross-sections of the geology of the Surat and Gunnedah Basins published in both Fairfax and News outlets. Simple diagrams to be sure, but purporting to show how destructive of the Artesian Basin aquifers CSG is …yet not one of these diagrams shows that the coal seams are 200m+ BELOW the Artesian Basin sedimentary aquifers. In fact, they don't include the coal seams at all anywhere in the sedimentary sequence – because this would then destroy the greenie propaganda value

    Unlike the Resident Dipstick, I prefer evidence before I post.

  69. Luke December 26, 2011 at 12:59 pm #

    Yo my man – lotsa 8’s – don’t worry about greenies old mate – it’s the FARMERS who want you out ! They’ll just keep monitoring the increasing hydrocarbons in previously clean groundwater – doesn’t have to be artesian now does it …. now off you go quietly …

    SD – I said “as it is”

    Tatts – only on the willy – says “WENDY” http://www.ebaumsworld.com/jokes/read/474827/

    Anyway I did enjoy the latest denialist expose http://www.skepticalscience.com/peter-sinclair-on-climate-sun-and-cosmic-rays.html

  70. John Sayers December 26, 2011 at 1:29 pm #

    Yeah SD – that Fort Dennison data matches Morner’s prediction of 100mm over 100years +/- 100mm. :)

  71. spangled drongo December 26, 2011 at 2:14 pm #

    That Wendy joke, eh, Mon, that’s as old as your old fella.

    It’s one thing for a movie producer to massage a bit of data [look what fat Al did and you still believe it], let’s face it, that’s what they do, but when skippy sci, Tony Jones, and luke are happy to ignore our science leaders, AKA the hockey team, doing it with the lights on and their pants down, yet prefer to make an example of Durkin’s forgotten efforts, it speaks volumes, particularly about how desperate you-all are for any argument to support “the cause”.

  72. ianl8888 December 26, 2011 at 3:23 pm #

    Resident Dipstick

    >Yo my man – lotsa 8′s – don’t worry about greenies old mate – it’s the FARMERS who want you out ! They’ll just keep monitoring the increasing hydrocarbons in previously clean groundwater – doesn’t have to be artesian now does it …. now off you go quietly …<

    Address the issue, you malignant dummy !

    Here it is again:

    "As a perfect recent example, we have seen many purported cross-sections of the geology of the Surat and Gunnedah Basins published in both Fairfax and News outlets. Simple diagrams to be sure, but purporting to show how destructive of the Artesian Basin aquifers CSG is …yet not one of these diagrams shows that the coal seams are 200m+ BELOW the Artesian Basin sedimentary aquifers. In fact, they don't include the coal seams at all anywhere in the sedimentary sequence – because this would then destroy the greenie propaganda value"

    Properly sealed drillholes solve minor leakage issues, but you still won't know the difference between Cenozoic and Jurassic sediments.You happily mix all this up in your tiny, dim little headspace and pretend this is science – well, soft science anyway (very soft)

    You are a perfect example of my point. Run away from a hard fact and make up c…p to cover your ignorance and cowardice. I've observed your endless pattern – argumentum ad hominen, straw men, irelevant links, sleazy evasion

    Ho hum, what a typical Watermelon

  73. Luke December 26, 2011 at 4:38 pm #

    ooooo – a bucolic ram-raiding geologist assuring croppers there won’t be problems when there obviously are. Lock the gates and shut the bastards out. Keep your benzene and toluene to yourselves. A diversionary spray against greens when its croppers rights and best cropping land in the nation that are the issue. So typical isn’t it of your industry just bullying its way across the landscape.

  74. spangled drongo December 26, 2011 at 7:54 pm #

    If Johnson is right about photons, problem solvered:

    http://climate-change-theory.com/radiation.html

  75. spangled drongo December 26, 2011 at 8:20 pm #

    You mean you witch hunters aren’t bucolic and ram-raiding?

    http://www.abc.net.au/unleashed/3747368.html

  76. Mack December 27, 2011 at 5:48 am #

    He’s a slippery little troll isn’t he. Merry xmas and a taxless new year.

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