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	<title>Comments on: Global Cooling has Begun: Bob Foster</title>
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	<link>http://jennifermarohasy.com/blog/2009/08/global-cooling-has-begun-bob-foster/</link>
	<description>a forum for the discussion of issues concerning the natural environment</description>
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		<title>By: Vince Whirlwind</title>
		<link>http://jennifermarohasy.com/blog/2009/08/global-cooling-has-begun-bob-foster/comment-page-2/#comment-153595</link>
		<dc:creator>Vince Whirlwind</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Dec 2009 04:39:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jennifermarohasy.com/blog/?p=6289#comment-153595</guid>
		<description>dhmo, anybody who has worked closely on plant growth and limiting factors knows that CO2 isn&#039;t normally a limiting factor for plant growth. 
This means that increasing CO2 has no effect. 
It would be like giving a plant extra water in the dark: the plant can&#039;t use it, because light is the limiting factor.
 
So please treat with scepticism any claim that &quot;increased CO2 encourages plant life&quot;, because by and large this is not a true statement.
 
As far as &quot;politics and dogma&quot; go, there is indeed plenty of that on view in this non-scientific debate.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>dhmo, anybody who has worked closely on plant growth and limiting factors knows that CO2 isn&#8217;t normally a limiting factor for plant growth.<br />
This means that increasing CO2 has no effect.<br />
It would be like giving a plant extra water in the dark: the plant can&#8217;t use it, because light is the limiting factor.</p>
<p>So please treat with scepticism any claim that &#8220;increased CO2 encourages plant life&#8221;, because by and large this is not a true statement.</p>
<p>As far as &#8220;politics and dogma&#8221; go, there is indeed plenty of that on view in this non-scientific debate.</p>
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		<title>By: dhmo</title>
		<link>http://jennifermarohasy.com/blog/2009/08/global-cooling-has-begun-bob-foster/comment-page-1/#comment-133099</link>
		<dc:creator>dhmo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Sep 2009 23:12:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jennifermarohasy.com/blog/?p=6289#comment-133099</guid>
		<description>Oops

I am with Chrisgo in that this is not an argument about the current doom and gloom it is more about how it will affect humans.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oops</p>
<p>I am with Chrisgo in that this is not an argument about the current doom and gloom it is more about how it will affect humans.</p>
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		<title>By: dhmo</title>
		<link>http://jennifermarohasy.com/blog/2009/08/global-cooling-has-begun-bob-foster/comment-page-1/#comment-133086</link>
		<dc:creator>dhmo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Sep 2009 21:00:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jennifermarohasy.com/blog/?p=6289#comment-133086</guid>
		<description>Louis they are not my gut feeling most of what I said is from Ian Plimer and the scientific works to back it up have been well documented. Increased SST means more rain and increased CO2 encourages plant life. You talk much science here the opposing side is talking politics and dogma of a very much religious bent. I am with Chrisgo in that this is not an argument about the current doom and gloom it is more about how it will humans. Somali has already achieved a low emissions economy is that our future?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Louis they are not my gut feeling most of what I said is from Ian Plimer and the scientific works to back it up have been well documented. Increased SST means more rain and increased CO2 encourages plant life. You talk much science here the opposing side is talking politics and dogma of a very much religious bent. I am with Chrisgo in that this is not an argument about the current doom and gloom it is more about how it will humans. Somali has already achieved a low emissions economy is that our future?</p>
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		<title>By: Ninderthana</title>
		<link>http://jennifermarohasy.com/blog/2009/08/global-cooling-has-begun-bob-foster/comment-page-1/#comment-133034</link>
		<dc:creator>Ninderthana</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Sep 2009 16:16:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jennifermarohasy.com/blog/?p=6289#comment-133034</guid>
		<description>Bob,

       Its all about cause and effect. The planets do not directly cause any significant climate  phenomenon here on the Earth. Any claim of this nature (i.e. a direct connection) is simply psuedo-science. It does not matter whethere you are talking of an electromagnetic or gravitional (e.g. tidal) connection, the forces and energies involved are just far too small
to be of any significance. 

       The planetary configuration of the Jovian planets directly determines the Sun&#039;s motion about the centre-of-mass the Solar System. It is possible that the level of the Sun&#039;s activity
is governed or moderated by variations in the Sun&#039;s differential rotation rate caused by a &quot;spin-orbit&quot; coupling between the Sun&#039;s rotation rate and its motion about the Solar System&#039;s Barycentre. Observational evidence exists for this &quot;spin-orbit&quot; coupling but, no one has yet come up with a valid physical mechanism to explain the observations.

      Some people argue that it is the planetary-driven variations in the level of solar activity that are primarily responsible for long term (centenial) variations in the Earth&#039;s climate and 
this is probably to a ceratin degree. So in this way, we could say that the planetary
configuration of the Jovian planets is INDIRECTLY reponsible for natural variations in climate conditions here on Earth (at least on centenial time scales).

     As you know, I believe that there is another indirect connection between the planetary motion and climate here on Earth. I have considerabe scientific evidence to support the
contention that variations in shape and orientation of the Moon&#039;s orbit are synchronized with the Solar Inertial Motion (SIM) about the Solar System&#039;s Barycentre. This synchronization has 
come about because of the gravational interactions between the Sun, Earth and Moon over billions of years.

     Convincing scientific evidence exists to show that the decadal varations in the shape and orientation of the Lunar orbit produce significant tidal dissipations in the deep oceans that provide close to half of the 2.7 T Watts of energy required to drive the overturning of cool deep water in the Earth&#039;s oceans (the remaining energy is provided by the Earth&#039;s winds).
I believe that it is this overturning of deep cool ocean that is responsible for setting the observed 60 year modulation of the Earth&#039;s ocean temperatures, trade winds and the yearly rainfall provided by the Indian Summer Monsoon.

Note: The 60 year modulation is a natural product of the beat period between the solar 
          forcing period (i.e. the Hale Cycle ~ 22.3 years) and the dominant forcing period
          produced by the assymetry in the SIM (~ 35.9 years):

                   (22.3 X 35.9) / (35.9 - 22.3) = 59.9 years

I have also shown that ENSO phenomenon, a climate system that has a great impact on Australia&#039;s long-term cliamte and weather, is governed by extreme proxigean spring tides. 

So, it would appear that the planetary configuration is responsible for the SIM, which over many billions of years has set, not only the variations in the level of solar activity, but also the
variations in the shape and orientation of the Lunar orbit, and hence the long-trem tidal dissipations in the Earth&#039;s oceans.   

And so, long-term changes (on centenial time scales) in the temperatures of the Earth&#039;s
oceans are set by a combination of the two main forcing terms, lunar tidal dissipation (which affects up welling of cool deep ocean water) and the level of solar activity.

The important thing is that both of these forcing terms are synchronized with the SIM which
is being driven by the long-term planetary configuration of the Jovian planets.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bob,</p>
<p>       Its all about cause and effect. The planets do not directly cause any significant climate  phenomenon here on the Earth. Any claim of this nature (i.e. a direct connection) is simply psuedo-science. It does not matter whethere you are talking of an electromagnetic or gravitional (e.g. tidal) connection, the forces and energies involved are just far too small<br />
to be of any significance. </p>
<p>       The planetary configuration of the Jovian planets directly determines the Sun&#8217;s motion about the centre-of-mass the Solar System. It is possible that the level of the Sun&#8217;s activity<br />
is governed or moderated by variations in the Sun&#8217;s differential rotation rate caused by a &#8220;spin-orbit&#8221; coupling between the Sun&#8217;s rotation rate and its motion about the Solar System&#8217;s Barycentre. Observational evidence exists for this &#8220;spin-orbit&#8221; coupling but, no one has yet come up with a valid physical mechanism to explain the observations.</p>
<p>      Some people argue that it is the planetary-driven variations in the level of solar activity that are primarily responsible for long term (centenial) variations in the Earth&#8217;s climate and<br />
this is probably to a ceratin degree. So in this way, we could say that the planetary<br />
configuration of the Jovian planets is INDIRECTLY reponsible for natural variations in climate conditions here on Earth (at least on centenial time scales).</p>
<p>     As you know, I believe that there is another indirect connection between the planetary motion and climate here on Earth. I have considerabe scientific evidence to support the<br />
contention that variations in shape and orientation of the Moon&#8217;s orbit are synchronized with the Solar Inertial Motion (SIM) about the Solar System&#8217;s Barycentre. This synchronization has<br />
come about because of the gravational interactions between the Sun, Earth and Moon over billions of years.</p>
<p>     Convincing scientific evidence exists to show that the decadal varations in the shape and orientation of the Lunar orbit produce significant tidal dissipations in the deep oceans that provide close to half of the 2.7 T Watts of energy required to drive the overturning of cool deep water in the Earth&#8217;s oceans (the remaining energy is provided by the Earth&#8217;s winds).<br />
I believe that it is this overturning of deep cool ocean that is responsible for setting the observed 60 year modulation of the Earth&#8217;s ocean temperatures, trade winds and the yearly rainfall provided by the Indian Summer Monsoon.</p>
<p>Note: The 60 year modulation is a natural product of the beat period between the solar<br />
          forcing period (i.e. the Hale Cycle ~ 22.3 years) and the dominant forcing period<br />
          produced by the assymetry in the SIM (~ 35.9 years):</p>
<p>                   (22.3 X 35.9) / (35.9 &#8211; 22.3) = 59.9 years</p>
<p>I have also shown that ENSO phenomenon, a climate system that has a great impact on Australia&#8217;s long-term cliamte and weather, is governed by extreme proxigean spring tides. </p>
<p>So, it would appear that the planetary configuration is responsible for the SIM, which over many billions of years has set, not only the variations in the level of solar activity, but also the<br />
variations in the shape and orientation of the Lunar orbit, and hence the long-trem tidal dissipations in the Earth&#8217;s oceans.   </p>
<p>And so, long-term changes (on centenial time scales) in the temperatures of the Earth&#8217;s<br />
oceans are set by a combination of the two main forcing terms, lunar tidal dissipation (which affects up welling of cool deep ocean water) and the level of solar activity.</p>
<p>The important thing is that both of these forcing terms are synchronized with the SIM which<br />
is being driven by the long-term planetary configuration of the Jovian planets.</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Martin</title>
		<link>http://jennifermarohasy.com/blog/2009/08/global-cooling-has-begun-bob-foster/comment-page-1/#comment-133006</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Martin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Sep 2009 14:17:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jennifermarohasy.com/blog/?p=6289#comment-133006</guid>
		<description>It is getting cooler, isn&#039;t it? 

I have noticed it, and friends and family in the Northeast and Midwest say the same thing.

It&#039;s been one of the coolest Summers on record there (and here).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is getting cooler, isn&#8217;t it? </p>
<p>I have noticed it, and friends and family in the Northeast and Midwest say the same thing.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s been one of the coolest Summers on record there (and here).</p>
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		<title>By: Nasif Nahle</title>
		<link>http://jennifermarohasy.com/blog/2009/08/global-cooling-has-begun-bob-foster/comment-page-1/#comment-132825</link>
		<dc:creator>Nasif Nahle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 Sep 2009 17:43:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jennifermarohasy.com/blog/?p=6289#comment-132825</guid>
		<description>Louis... I know that currently the Earth&#039;s sea floor is spreading at a rate of ~8 cm per year. How one could draw a parallel the phenomenon described in your article &lt;i&gt;Plate Tectonics Subducted&lt;/i&gt; with the Earth&#039;s expansion? Is there any correlation?

I must confess that I need lots of information on this issue. Please, keep in mind that I got trained in standard structural geology and have to fit together some things from the biological stack and your theory.

Nasif</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Louis&#8230; I know that currently the Earth&#8217;s sea floor is spreading at a rate of ~8 cm per year. How one could draw a parallel the phenomenon described in your article <i>Plate Tectonics Subducted</i> with the Earth&#8217;s expansion? Is there any correlation?</p>
<p>I must confess that I need lots of information on this issue. Please, keep in mind that I got trained in standard structural geology and have to fit together some things from the biological stack and your theory.</p>
<p>Nasif</p>
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		<title>By: WilliMc</title>
		<link>http://jennifermarohasy.com/blog/2009/08/global-cooling-has-begun-bob-foster/comment-page-1/#comment-132820</link>
		<dc:creator>WilliMc</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 Sep 2009 15:21:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jennifermarohasy.com/blog/?p=6289#comment-132820</guid>
		<description>Louis,

I found what appears to be the original publication in the library:

Les formations glaciaires du Precambrien terminal et de la fin de l&#039;Ordovicien en Afrique de l&#039;Ouest : deux exemples de glaciation d&#039;inlandsis sur une plate-forme stable

1980, Deynoux, Max.

Saint-Jerome, Marseille : Laboratoire de geologie dynamique, Faculte des sciences et techniques [1980]  

I could make a copy for you, if you are unable to locate one closer to home.

WilliMc</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Louis,</p>
<p>I found what appears to be the original publication in the library:</p>
<p>Les formations glaciaires du Precambrien terminal et de la fin de l&#8217;Ordovicien en Afrique de l&#8217;Ouest : deux exemples de glaciation d&#8217;inlandsis sur une plate-forme stable</p>
<p>1980, Deynoux, Max.</p>
<p>Saint-Jerome, Marseille : Laboratoire de geologie dynamique, Faculte des sciences et techniques [1980]  </p>
<p>I could make a copy for you, if you are unable to locate one closer to home.</p>
<p>WilliMc</p>
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		<title>By: WilliMc</title>
		<link>http://jennifermarohasy.com/blog/2009/08/global-cooling-has-begun-bob-foster/comment-page-1/#comment-132819</link>
		<dc:creator>WilliMc</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 Sep 2009 15:05:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jennifermarohasy.com/blog/?p=6289#comment-132819</guid>
		<description>Louis,

I forgot to mention the time period -- Ordrovician -- in the neighborhood of 450 million years ago.
I also seem to recall mention was made of a pole in the southern part of the Sahara, but may be an error.

WilliMc</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Louis,</p>
<p>I forgot to mention the time period &#8212; Ordrovician &#8212; in the neighborhood of 450 million years ago.<br />
I also seem to recall mention was made of a pole in the southern part of the Sahara, but may be an error.</p>
<p>WilliMc</p>
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		<title>By: WilliMc</title>
		<link>http://jennifermarohasy.com/blog/2009/08/global-cooling-has-begun-bob-foster/comment-page-1/#comment-132817</link>
		<dc:creator>WilliMc</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 Sep 2009 15:00:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jennifermarohasy.com/blog/?p=6289#comment-132817</guid>
		<description>Louis:

I believe the publication I read was a translation of the following:

Deynoux, M. 1985, Les Glaciations du Sahara, La Recherche 16 (169) 986-997.

Good Hunting,

WilliMc</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Louis:</p>
<p>I believe the publication I read was a translation of the following:</p>
<p>Deynoux, M. 1985, Les Glaciations du Sahara, La Recherche 16 (169) 986-997.</p>
<p>Good Hunting,</p>
<p>WilliMc</p>
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		<title>By: J.Hansford</title>
		<link>http://jennifermarohasy.com/blog/2009/08/global-cooling-has-begun-bob-foster/comment-page-1/#comment-132814</link>
		<dc:creator>J.Hansford</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 01 Sep 2009 14:41:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://jennifermarohasy.com/blog/?p=6289#comment-132814</guid>
		<description>Interesting stuff Louis..... I&#039;ll reserve my opinion, but I am quite happy to chuck theories in the bin when the core sample says Billion instead of 200 million.... I&#039;m sure there&#039;ll be plenty of scientists that will be tempted to throw the sample in the bin instead, if they come up older than 200 mil.... But that&#039;s what sorts the sheep from the scientists, &#039;eh.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Interesting stuff Louis&#8230;.. I&#8217;ll reserve my opinion, but I am quite happy to chuck theories in the bin when the core sample says Billion instead of 200 million&#8230;. I&#8217;m sure there&#8217;ll be plenty of scientists that will be tempted to throw the sample in the bin instead, if they come up older than 200 mil&#8230;. But that&#8217;s what sorts the sheep from the scientists, &#8216;eh.</p>
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